protein supplement - HELP

[hitanshu]

krishna,

unless u start riding like RNair, we just need electrolytes. rest is just marking BS.

[raknair]

As some of you know I have been working on a 3 training month programme designed by my brother. I am now 7 weeks into it and I have another 5 weeks to go before the much awaited grand tour begins in December. For the past 3 weeks or so, I have been introduced to Creatine. The initial idea was to consume Whey Protein but after reading a number of articles on the internet (though not full proof) I decided not to go for it. Most of the articles points whey protein to weight training and clearly says the risks involved to the kidney and liver. I drink milk (mostly it is milky tea ) at least half a glass a day. Orange juice is now 4-5 day affair. Since the training programme had begun on the 19th of September I have ridden over 1545 kms, averaging about 260 kms per week. The load factor is very heavy - one week ride include - regular intervals, ladder intervals, tempos of 30 & 45 mins, aerobic / endurance ride of at least 65 - 75 kms.

The stress levels have increased several times. Creatine has done wonders to me. The 1st week began with a teaspoon and half mixed with apple juice and now I take one spoon with cold milk or juice daily. The supplement is being taken keeping in mind the build up towards TFN. Unless you train like Baba Velo who rides close to 10,000 miles a year of which a good portion is spent riding on very high gradient and tuff conditions. I know I will stop taking the creatine once TFN is over. Since I get my regular protein and other vitamins through regular food I do not need supplements in the form of Whey or Creatine. The Creatine container clearly says I have to drink at least 8 - 10 glasses of water every day. I eat egg at least twice a week now.

I have a glass of juice with Creatine before I stop out for my morning ride. I feel very good in my legs and recovery part does not need any special mention. My legs feel very fresh. But I somehow feel nothing can replace this supplement as much as a good healthy food. Got to confess my vada pav intake has also come down to just one in a week.

[RNair]

One fact! None of these supplements will do anything unless you really get an intense workout day after day!

I do think unless you are riding competitively at the highest levels of the sports, one does not need any supplements. Natural deficiencies are a different case and needs medical advice.

[krishna.sjc]

I have been introduced to Creatine. The initial idea was to consume Whey Protein but after reading a number of articles on the internet (though not full proof) I decided not to go for it. Most of the articles points whey protein to weight training and clearly says the risks involved to the kidney and liver.

hmmm i went through some articles on net and most of them seems to say that Creatine has got more side effects that Whey protein both long term and short term.i guess the moral of the story is every supplements has got its advantages and disadvantages..

[raknair]

Yes ! that's the reason why you do not need supplements if you are an easy rider. The workout and intensity you put in is what that matters. I do not see myself taking it for too long. The only reason I take it is because I am required to do some very painful workouts and at the end of the day all I can think of it sleep and eat. lol.

All supplements have some negativism. I think it is meant for people who have some natural deficiencies.

Ra! says it clearly above "I do think unless you are riding competitively at the highest levels of the sports, one does not need any supplements. Natural deficiencies are a different case and needs medical advice."

[RNair]

I wish Saturated fatty food came with a list of warnings, health risks and side effects. I am 100% it would look far worse.

[kk27]

I'm not sure if drinking milk with a scoop of Protein powder after a workout is supplement!!! I sometimes switch it with a scoop of Chocolate powder. This was actually recommended to me by a Doc (who said since Indian diet is more or less veg based it's good to have Protein for individuals active in sports). He also said that it's good to have atlest 1 or 2 meat dishes in a week.

Rak - what Creatine powder you take? I take Protein powder made by Wockhard, tastes good and no after effects.

[Minkey Chief]

I'm taking a middle line here.

I can understand... Actually, I share the wariness about supplements like this, but at the same I'd be wary of making statements (a bit like the recent safety thread) that go: "Unless you train as hard as x/Do x miles a year, you don't need them/they are BS."

I completely agree that if they're starting out, nearly all riders don't need to worry about supplements. Just sort out your real food eating. I say 'nearly all' because some people start out like maniacs. I've just heard about a first year rider who won a beginner title in his first year, and then state in the second year, then national in the third! This is why I don't like making or reading blanket statements.

If you're pushing YOURSELF (not in relation to someone else), several times a week, and need to be well recovered from each workout, then protein powder can be a good tool to have around. Note that I'm not saying it's essential or that you dose on protein three times a day, but simply that it can be useful after the occasional hard/long workout, especially if you don't have a quality meal to eat in the 30min window.

On the bike and the 30min (or one hour, depending on who you're reading) window, are the two times you can worry less about processed foods, because that's when you need stuff to get into your system quickly. I have a long climb on Saturday, so I stocked up on some Hammer gels. I'd never normally buy or consume something like that--ours is a house with nuts and fruit for snacks. So in my mind that falls into the "supplement" category, and a few years ago I might have made blanket statements about it. But now, I have great respect for foods that get into your system quickly because they are lifesavers on the bike.

In fact, I come away with even more respect for the kind of energy in these foods. When you drink one Coke and it fuels you like a train for the last 15 rolling miles home, you become very wary about drinking one when sitting on a sofa!

[raknair]

@ KK - thats the one I take - http://www.healthkart.com/product/on-creatine-powder-creapure/NUT319

I am very conservative in my intake. I started off with 1.5 spoons daily for a week to get my muscles saturated with the powder and now I take only a teaspoon with a glass of apple or orange juice daily before I step out for my ride. I do not take in excess as I am a non-veg and I eat quite a lot of white meat / fish. I will stop it once TFN is over.

[raknair]

@ Minkey & Doc Rao - why do you not like Amway product ? I have never taken any of their products but I am curious to why it is a strict NO for you both.

[Minkey Chief]

@ Minkey & Doc Rao - why do you not like Amway product ?

Search for 'Scamway' or even just 'Amway' on Google--lots of stuff out there. Especially interesting is the analysis of Amway as a cult. I've also had personal experience with Amway recruiters, one of them over a few sessions with a couple who used to live in the same complex as we did. I got a good view into how the recruitment process works and the language they use. It's pretty scary. (Amway also goes by Quixtar in the US--a search with that name brings up a lot of stuff as well.)

I've also read and heard repeatedly (online and from people who've actually used them) that their products are really over-priced. They're not bad, but are priced as if they're way better than anything on the market. Amway people claim they are concentrated or more effective, and hence much cheaper in the long run. Lots of people who've tried their cleaning products say this isn't the case at all.

However, I've heard that Amway is working hard to change its image and change how the company works.

I'd said an Amway discussion didn't belong here, but wrote this post anyway. I can't ask anyone to not respond, certainly, but if you're an Amway supporter and upset by my post and want to war, please let's branch out to the Joint.

[cheewachai]

While I hate amway recruiters ... I like their car shampoo... even for cleaning bikes.

[hitanshu]

Two things:
- Amway products are decent and now ok ok priced. Esp the protein in particular. Of course we have an "amway gold etc business owner" in the family but when my wife was pregnant - I compared all products - Nutrilite has far less sugar. Amway's big packs are at par with stuff like Mama Horlicks/Threptin etc in price and their offer packs are actually cheaper. Yes, their cosmetics are ridiculously priced, and so are some supplements (garlic for eg). But the iron folic supplement is okay in price. Yes, the whole problem is the cult
- Most products like bournvita/horlicks are peasofshite. Bournvita (?) had 87% sugar in one of their packs, and others were 70% or so. Complan's memory booster has 12% fat and lists it in the "Vital Nutrient list" and says Fat is good for skin. LOL. the crap they'll write to sell any formulation!!

[bblost]

While I hate amway recruiters ... I like their car shampoo... even for cleaning bikes.

I use Clinic Plus Anti Dandruff Shampoo. It works quite well.
Sunsilk is also quite nice. But the former has a nice smell.

But the best shampoo for a car is easy to spot. Buy the cheapest one.

[wanderingwheels]

I use Clinic Plus Anti Dandruff Shampoo. It works quite well.
Sunsilk is also quite nice. But the former has a nice smell.

But the best shampoo for a car is easy to spot. Buy the cheapest one.

Really? I think the paint will fade if you use hair shampoo. Compare before-and-after pics.

[bblost]

My car is 2004 model. Paint looks decent.

In fact last week, I was taking a test drive of the new swift. The SA was complimenting the paint on my Wagon R.

The hair shampoo is mild enough on your skin. Its not gonna hurt the metal/ paint on a car.
If you are still worried, try Johnson's No more tears shampoo.

Just remembered. I also wax the car using Carbura after applying the shampoo.

[wanderingwheels]

Hmm, i will try it on my Yamaha some time. Thanks dude.

[krishna.sjc]

guys this is a thread on protein supplements not abt some shampoos

[Minkey Chief]

Hitman and Siva thanks for the feedback. Will update the opinion but am not sure if I'm ready to give them my money. Bad memories of my interaction with the cultists, as we called them. No insult intended to your family Amway person, Hitanshu!

[farazs]

Complan's memory booster has 12% fat and lists it in the "Vital Nutrient list"

Pretty sure it is *vital* in more ways than one, even more so in the growth phase.

and says Fat is good for skin

... which too is not categorically incorrect. Google that!

[hitanshu]

Minkey,

I completely agree. Whatever run in i've had with any group of Amway folks has left me shaking my head

I have no choice therefore I must use Amway products

That said, I am personally completely clear about which of those products are effective and (almost) VFM or not. I can recommend a limited subset which I've done - reg the rest of their products, I really understand your sentiments

[Quizling]

I've used Optimum Nutrition's whey protein (though I'm more into aerobics than weight training - time to concentrate on the latter!) Recently I also bought ON's oats+whey which claims to provide fibre as well. But I'm sparing with dosage - one 2lb tub lasts me over a month, because I also get protein from meat/fish/eggs. I guess my weight loss (about 10 kilos over the past year) can be attributed to a combination of regular cycling/walking and occasional supplements such as this.

As for Amway, I was introduced to it one fine day in 1998, when some loser buttonholed me on the #india-bangalore room in TalkCity (anyone here old enough to remember the days of IRC and BBSes?) and bugged me for an hour about an amazing new company that's just entered India and which was going to help me earn piles of money in my spare time. I lost my Amway virginity right there, and since then I've had no patience for such folk. Sadly, the easiest way to lose a friend is to lose them to Amway (or another MLM racket).

[bblost]

I guess my weight loss (about 10 kilos over the past year) can be attributed to a combination of regular cycling/walking and occasional supplements such as this.

I have always thought that to lose weight via the Whey supplements, one would need to replace a meal with a whey shake.
This would give a dose of protein without fats.

Functionally it would be like eating chicken/fish boiled with just some Garlic+salt+pepper. But not as tasty.

[Max~*]

Well actually nutrilite products are the best i feel...well thats me.

[rpok]

I have also started taking Creatine since past week. Last week was loading with 2tbsp (20gm) a day. This week i'll go to 1tbsp (10gm) a day. I take it with water before a workout.
So far i haven't noticed anything different in my performance on the bike.
Last year i used to take a lot of Vit capsules, but this year i haven't taken any. And i never felt the lack of it.
I do take whey after workout coz i dont take any special recovery drink. Whey acts as a decent recovery.
That said, i do have ordered a good set of SIS, Zipvit and Powerbar products to take especially during the race
I've noticed i have hardly been eating in a race. Or taking caffeine during the race. Delhi race i suffered coz i didn't take caffeine in race or had carb gels.
For a road race of 70-120kms where speeds are 40-42kmph avg, you need to top up the carbs and electrolytes.

PowerBar Protein Plus 80% DrinkLion Bar 700g
Zipvit Sport Zv2 Energy Drink Extreme Orange - 1.05kg
PowerBar Power Gels Vanilla 41g (Box 24)
High5 Zero Xtreme Electrolyte Tablets Berry - 20 Tablets (Caffeine Stimulant)
Science In Sport Go Electrolyte Sports Fuel Tub Blackcurrant - 1.6kg